Middlesbrough Council - News Forum - Setting a light to the News

MJ Carr v Ray Mallon. The Labour candidate, versus 'Labours' Candidate. With all the clart flying around concerning Mallon (and I'm sure that regulars on the EG forum will recall that I've been quite critical of Mallon in the past) I'm not so sure that I want to vote for him. If you believe the critics and condemners, he is 'Labour' in all but name.

Meanwhile, MJ Carr, the 'Labour' candidate who we are told, wouldn't toe the party line. So, conversely, he's Labour in name only. I've read his latest election flyer and I agree with much of what he says. My only gripe is with him saying 'Vote MJ Carr for Change'. How is a Labour candidate a change from someone who is Labour in all but name? And, if he will not be held to ransom by the Labour Party, why is he standing as a Labour candidate? If MJ Carr was standing as an Independent, he would be the 'credible Independent candidate' that I feel middlesbrough needs. But he's standing as a Labour candidate. What gaurantee can we have that, once he's elected, he won't be a party patsy? And what of those that elect him as a Labour candidate? How will they view him if he doesn't act in the best interests of the party?

In the absence of a credible Independent candidate, I'm at a loss over who should get my vote.

Can you simply vote for your local councillor, and not vote at all in the mayoral aspect, or would that be regarded as a spoiled paper?

For me, this would be the only course of action right now. I still regard the removal of the Labour majority as the essential requisite for Middlesbrough to move forward, the mayoral role is secondary to this. So, at this point in time, three days before the polls are open, I really dont have a candidate to vote for as mayor.

Hi RR,

Not having a pop at you on this, but maybe things are beginning to dawn on people, with this guy, WYSI (is not) WYG.

The pimpernel said it all.

Tosha

I've been thinking the same RR. I'm not a Mallon fan of late,as i think he is all mouth but no action. Having said that,Carr would not get my vote,or any Labour candidate come to that. That leaves Foote Wood,who i was going to vote for,but would that help Carr to get in? I have no time for Boro cars clan,they want Mallon out and a Labour a puppet in,imo.I am glad Mallon stood up to them,but whether that will go for or against him,remains to be seen.

if 'antonios' recent action of bumping a load of threads where I was the OP (some of which I inheritted from other banned and 'wiped' users, not all were originally mine) showed me anything, it was that I have historically agreed with Tosha that Mallon is far from perfect and his record as mayor shows that he has bitten off too many projects that are now sat unfinished and unfundable (sp?) when he could have taken things one 'vision' at a time. If he had, for instance, concentrated solely on the old St Hildas project, which I think was his original 'vision', then he should, by now be able to hold it up as an example of a vibrant, regenerated community. Instead its an almost empty near-slum. And Gresham is going the same way. Now, if Mallon was to say 'look at what I have done for the town', it would be asking to be de-selected.

Frankly I think his 'vision' for Gresham is wrong. If you sand-blasted the houses in Gresham back to their clean red-brick, they would regain much of their lost character and help to make the place look 'cleaner'. If you look over need the university at some of the street-houses there that have been converted into student accommodation, you would see what mean. Many of the red-brick houses in Middlesbrough are simply 'stained' by the towns industrial past. All they need is a good wash! The problem now is, the same can't be said of the people that are left there. Many of the 'good' residents have gone, with only those pitched in for a fair deal or trapped by the circumstances left to live among the social problems which are now rife in that part of town. And the residents that cause them.

When you look at his track record, he SHOULD be unelectable. Taxigate, which I think is an absolute disgraceful way to behave on Bashirs part, BTW, seems to have consolidated Mallons vote, rather than dimished it. Suddenly 'City Status' has gone right out of the window! It doesn't even get a mention in his election leaflet. Guess that's because some of us saw straight through that particular ruse...

But what is the alternative to an Independent mayor whose detractors proclaim him to be Labour in all but name? A Labour mayor who proclaims himself to be Labour in name only?

Elect Independent Mallon and, should Labour lose its chokehold on the town, he is free to 'side' with whosoever he wishes. One of the allegations that others have levelled at Mallon is that he 'cosies up' to whoever he thinks can further his career at any given time. Which means that, if Labour dont have a majority next week, he can, indeed should, create an executive that reflects the make-up of the council in microcosm.

Elect Labour man MJ Carr, and, even if Labour have no majority in Middlesbrough, it will be his job to ensure that the same old faces sit in the executive seats come May 6th. Either that or he will face expulsion from the party because detractors are not tolerated in Labour Middlesbrough. He has no option and as such, I think this 'MJ Carr for change in Middlesbrough' campaign is a lie.

My dilemma is that do I vote for the man that has led a Labour executive while they've destroyed large parts of the town, or do I vote for a man who I think will allow Labour to continue to do so, even if they no longer hold the majority.

As I have said before, it's the council that needs to change, not the figurehead. Maybe I'm swaying back to 'better the devil you know', this morning...

Hi RR,

One of the allegations that others have levelled at Mallon is that he 'cosies up' to whoever he thinks can further his career at any given time.

One in particular was whom I refer to as the Pimpernel! Again IMO he was correct.

Elect Labour man MJ Carr, and, even if Labour have no majority in Middlesbrough, it will be his job to ensure that the same old faces sit in the executive seats come May 6th. Either that or he will face expulsion from the party because detractors are not tolerated in Labour Middlesbrough. He has no option and as such, I think this 'MJ Carr for change in Middlesbrough' campaign is a lie.

My opinion too!

As I have said before, it's the council that needs to change, not the figurehead. Maybe I'm swaying back to 'better the devil you know', this morning...

I'm not wavering, it needs a clean sweep, a good clear out, but, one thing I am beginning to feel after the last two days, seeing some of the stuff up front, after the count, the status quo will prevail, it might even be worse.
Or, It will be much a muchness.

Tosha

Surely, it's the prerogative of an Independent mayor to 'cosy up' in such a manner? Part of the reason I would vote for an Independent mayor is that, regardless of which party(s) are in power, an Independent mayor (and council) can appeal to them for help without party politics getting in the way. As Middlesbrough probably won't elect a LibDem/Tory mayor or council in our lifetime, and the country will probably not elect another Labour government anytime soon, Indy has always seemed to be the obvious way of affecting change in Middlesbrough.

MJ Carr is Labour. We currently have a Labour executive, installed by the mayor, to reflect the Labour majority in Middlesbrough. To the extent that others label him as Labour in all but name. In the event that Labour lose their majority, only an Independent mayor can install an executive that reflects the sea-change in town.

It's funny to see how many houses owned locally by Asian taxi drivers have sprouted MJ Carr posters and hoardings in the last week. So they'll support Bashir in his crusade against Mallon, supporting a Labour mayor, but Bashirs whole campaign was started because Labour led MBC Wupped his butt in court? Curious. especially when, in Middlehaven, rumour has it that the strong Asian vote will support the Asian Labour candidate, but NOT the other Labour candidate.

So, they are FOR a Labour mayor but AGAINST those of the Labour party who sit on the MBC executive. Funny old world.

Especially when you consider that, when Mallon made his comments about 'some taxi drivers are scumbags' and 'the worst offenders are Asians', Bashir responded in the affirmative!

Hi RR,

Surely, it's the prerogative of an Independent mayor to 'cosy up' in such a manner?

I reckon he has to repay (IMO) a debt, for being elected and (supported) against the official Labour candidate with Labour support.
Too many about faces, Bell and Co.
One person whom I have a lot of respect for, also saw what happened, and changed his opinion of the mayor subsequently, actively posting so in EG letters, after supporting him prior.
My understanding was that the Mayor has the power. He and the exec make the decisions, with a different exec maybe he could have been independent, but he selected the exec?

A real independent Mayor is what is required. So my opinion stays the same for me. Mallon has failed, MJ Carr IMO is a card carrying party member, so I can't see him turly bucking the party! Unless he is truly prepared to be booted out.

So, they are FOR a Labour mayor but AGAINST those of the Labour party who sit on the MBC executive. Funny old world.

My comments earlier, however, stated slightly differently.

I'm sure Bashir is a realist and a hard headed businessman, and recognises some truth in in the comment as to scumbags and Asians, but I would also balance that by saying it isn't only Asians.

Tosha

“In his statement in the Evening Gazette on Monday he says: ‘If I had given Mr Bashir what he wanted he would not have released these tapes so that shows my decision making was not improper’.

“If he did not reward me in the past why would I expect it now or in the future?”

http://www.gazettelive.co.uk/news/teess ... -28632575/

Mr Bashir said the key to the riddle was to be found in the article on the same page.

He said: “Mr Mallon called one Labour councillor ******* biased about the ongoing feud over the taxi trade in the town. Mr Mallon spoke about his fury at his Executive Member and Labour councillor Barry Coppinger who wrote to a supermarket favouring Boro Taxis’ competitors and portraying Boro Cars in a poor light.”

Mr Bashir said Boro Taxis tried to resolve the issue through proper channels but said Mr Mallon “secretly” took charge of the matter. It was then Mr Bashir decided to tape meetings.

He added: “The tapes were then released as Mr Mallon, following a recent court case, publicly criticised, through the Gazette, myself and my company and also praised his officers despite saying the opposite about them to me.

“This is what this issue is all about and it has nothing to do with the election for mayor.”

Tosha

The exec reflected the Labour majority in Middlesbrough. To ignore it would have been extremely undemocratic.

Mallon needed to repay a debt to Labour? Maybe. But if he gets back in and Labour lose their majority, he owes the people of Middlesbrough a debt - to deliver the sort of change Middlesbrough needs. And he is free to honour that debt. With Carr in his place, we would never know and it will be business (or lack of it) as usual for a Labour led MBC.

And I agree, that not all taxi drivers are scumbags; not all Asian taxidrivers are scumbags; not all Asians are scumbags and I'm pretty sure that there are plenty of scumbags that are neither Asian nor taxi drivers. You find them in all walks of life. But in reference to the taxi trade in Middlesbrough, Mallon stated that SOME drivers are scumbags and the WORST (not only) offenders were Asian. When Mallon made these comments, Bashir responded in the affirmative. So, either Bashir agreed with him or, knowing that the conversation was being recorded, he was leading Mallon on.

Moving on to your second post. How did Mallon 'secretly' take charge of the matter if he spent so much time on the phone to Mr Bashir?!

And I think, if it was nothing to do with the election for mayor, that all those houses of taxi drivers with the MJ Carr posters (where did they get all of them from, one wonders?) wouldn't have said posters on displpay.

Hi RR,

And I think, if it was nothing to do with the election for mayor, that all those houses of taxi drivers with the MJ Carr posters (where did they get all of them from, one wonders?) wouldn't have said posters on displpay.

That can only be speculation.

As I said, I doubt now the mess this town is in is going to change, unless something changes drastically.

I'm off to kip out in the morning 7 ish.

Tosha

Hi Isthatso,

Your comments I find unsurprising.
Mallon didn't reside in Middlesbrough, so he would have been unlikely to have known as to the renovations, central heating, roofs etc, he is never very uptodate with what HAS gone on in this town in those respects, so I can understand easily him stating he was unaware!
The other point as to further sandblasting and cleaning up properties, again, it does not surprise me one IOTA as to his lack of awareness, the classic example of his awareness is writ large in the Cleveland Scientific debacle, where he knew nothing of that either.

Tosha

http://www.pancrack.tv/news2006.html

before



after



extreme Ray Mallon sandblasting?

Hi Borobot,



Maybe he just forgot it was there or, never noticed, he must have always come to work via the Hartington Interchange?

A Three Wise Monkeys production maybe?

Tosha